Overview of How Long Gone — Episode 872 (W. David Marx)
Chris Black and Jason Stewart host a wide-ranging conversation with cultural critic and author W. David Marx (book: Blank Space: A Cultural History of the 21st Century), recorded on the book’s launch day. The episode mixes personal travel and food anecdotes with a thoughtful, often irreverent, dive into modern culture: media gossip economies, the rise/fall of internet-era trends (NFTs, crypto, meme culture), K‑pop’s factory model, AI-generated media, music trends, and Marx’s writing process and research approach.
Guest & book
- Guest: W. David Marx (often misheard/spelled as “Marks” in the transcript). Resident in Japan, on a US tour for his book.
- Book: Blank Space: A Cultural History of the 21st Century — released the day of the episode. Marx discusses how the book traces 21st-century cultural shifts and digital-era transformations.
- Tour stops mentioned: New York (launch), Boston (alumni event), with Marx noting being “on the ground” for launch week.
Key topics and highlights
-
Media/gossip economy
- Discussion of Olivia Nuzzi’s book coverage, the swirl of media infighting, and how gossip now operates like a 24/7 industry.
- Concerns about surveillance culture, paparazzi, doxxing and sites/apps that crowdsource celebrity sightings (Gawker Stalker → modern equivalents).
- Marx argues clicks (both love- and hate-clicks) drive coverage and that the systems cannot easily distinguish curiosity from genuine interest.
- Predicted small rebellions against gossip-driven culture, but acknowledges money makes the behavior sticky.
-
Writing process and craft
- Marx’s method: outline first, heavy research, then systematic expansion — compares writing a book to architectural work.
- Comments on different book styles: rapid-phone-memoir approach (e.g., claims about other authors writing on phones) vs. Marx’s dense, researched history.
- On publishing economics: memoirs of famous people sell well initially; research-driven cultural histories may gain value over time.
-
AI, video, and media futures
- Marx predicts AI/video generation will democratize and saturate visual media (anyone will be able to produce Scorsese-esque clips by prompt).
- As generated content becomes ubiquitous, real-life experiences and in-person events may regain cultural value.
- Concern that mass generation will devalue mediated content; also that authenticity and IRL events will become more prized.
-
NFTs, crypto, and hype cycles
- Hosts and Marx reflect on the NFT/crypto boom, rug pulls, bored ape imagery, and how alternative-culture status became tied to financial speculation.
- Acknowledges real winners exist (early Bitcoin adopters) but laments the toxic culture and overpromises of the crypto/NFT era.
-
Music & pop culture trends
- Debate about whether culture is “stuck” — comparisons to earlier eras (The Strokes, Geese, Katy Perry/Black Eyed Peas — “recession pop”).
- Comments on K‑pop’s training system, artist incubation, and how it differs from western pop manufacturing.
- Thoughts on global exportability of American shows (Yellowstone, 1883/1884-style dramas) and whether their appeal is domestic-first.
- AI music examples: Marx tried prompting Suno and found it produced derivative results (e.g., a Wonderwall-like output), showing current limits and ethical/creative concerns.
-
Personal & cultural asides (color & atmosphere)
- Travel anecdotes: London (Fortnum & Mason, hotel picks like The Zetter), NYC hotels (Nine Orchard), dinner/portion-size jokes (barbecued/grilled monkfish), and San Vicente Bungalows ice cream nights.
- Nostalgia/wardrobe chat: denim/selvedge culture, “22-year-old hustle” myth (Vice 22 rule), smoking hand-rolled cigs abroad, record-bag vintage references.
Notable quotes & short insights
- “Never start with a blank sheet of paper.” — Marx on writing.
- “Clicks are the same whether it’s love or hate.” — on modern editorial incentives.
- Prediction: “Everything online will be generated… the only thing you'll trust is to see things in real life.”
- On cultural value: research-driven books can gain value over decades as immediate coverage fades.
Main takeaways
- The attention economy rewards immediacy and salaciousness; that shapes what gets covered and how journalists and platforms behave.
- AI/video generation will massively expand creative production, likely devaluing mediated content and making in-person experiences more culturally precious.
- The crypto/NFT era offered huge upside stories and many rug pulls — it altered what “alternative culture” meant for a while (speculation ≈ alternative).
- There remains enduring value in deep, researched cultural histories even if the market favors quick memoirs and viral formats.
- Marx’s disciplined, outline-first writing is a practical model for long-form work in an era obsessed with speed.
Recommended actions / resources mentioned
- Read: Blank Space: A Cultural History of the 21st Century (available on launch day). Suggested retailers mentioned: Barnes & Noble, Bookshop.org, McNally Jackson.
- If you care about media literacy and the effects of the attention economy, follow Marx’s work for longer-term cultural analysis rather than daily gossip.
- Expect and prepare for more AI-generated media — prioritize in-person experiences and critical media literacy.
Episode sponsors (brief)
The hosts read multiple sponsor spots in-episode: Squarespace, Rocket Money, Bubz Naturals (collagen), Skims, and BetterHelp.
— End of summary —