Overview of The Watch
Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald discuss the upheaval at DC Studios, what makes an indie rock album list meaningful, and recent episodes of Black Doves and The Lowdown. Their main thread is how audiences and studios have changed: a shared cinematic universe or a prestigious ranking can attract attention, but lasting value comes from strong stories, distinctive choices, and the context in which people encounter them.
What’s Next for DC?
The hosts unpack James Gunn and Peter Safran’s departure from DC Studios and the uncertainty around the franchise’s direction under Skydance. They note that Gunn’s exit appeared to catch people by surprise, while reports and rumors about the timing, the future of Man of Tomorrow, and possible changes to its post-production remain unsettled.
They discuss Jeremy Latcham’s arrival and his “grandma test”: whether a story can connect with a broad audience beyond dedicated fans. The hosts wonder whether that outlook could lead DC toward safer, more conventional superhero films, though they stress that this is speculation. Gunn’s own Superman, they argue, was already aiming for a broad audience while leaving room for different kinds of stories.
Their larger concern is that studios may be chasing the success of the Marvel Cinematic Universe without understanding what made it work. Interconnected characters can be an appealing extra, but audiences still need compelling films and stars. With enormous budgets and company debt at stake, studios want billion-dollar hits; smaller, unusual projects such as Clayface may struggle to meet those expectations even if they appeal to genre fans. The hosts see no simple formula for recreating the MCU’s breakthrough.
Pitchfork’s 100 Best Indie Rock Albums
Ryan and Greenwald find Pitchfork’s list useful as a prompt to revisit albums and argue about what “indie rock” means. Greenwald thinks the ranking reflects Pitchfork’s own history and readership, with a tilt toward more recent music. He also notes the absence of several foundational punk and indie acts, including the Replacements, Fugazi, and Hüsker Dü.
For Greenwald, indie rock is defined partly by the time and context in which listeners discovered it: hearing new bands while also tracing their influences. Streaming has made music easier to access across labels, but it has changed the experience of discovering a scene and its independent infrastructure.
The hosts welcome choices that might spark debate or introduce listeners to overlooked records. They call attention to Interpol’s Turn on the Bright Lights, Destroyer’s Rubies, and Life Without Buildings’ Any Other City. Ryan especially champions Superchunk’s Here’s Where the Strings Come In, describing it as a formative favorite and a record that captures the band moving beyond its earlier breakup album, Foolish. Their discussion turns into a broader reflection on how critical consensus changes with each generation.
Black Doves Season 2
Ryan says the season is gaining momentum: the second episode builds on the premiere by sharpening the show’s mix of wit, violence, and emotional stakes. He praises the clearer sense of how its central characters fit into the world and the way the season is developing its supporting cast. The hosts save a fuller discussion for a later episode.
The Lowdown Season 2, Episode 6 — Spoilers
The hosts praise the episode’s shift from a crime-thriller plot into a moving story about parents, children, and missed chances. Lee Raybon’s investigation and his growing relationship with Ginger drive the first half; the second centers on Lee’s uneasy reconnection with his father, played by Tommy Lee Jones.
Lee and his father share a quiet moment before his father dies in the van. The hosts appreciate that the episode avoids a tidy reconciliation: Lee learns more about his father, including his Vietnam service, but their relationship remains unfinished. Ethan Hawke’s restrained performance and the episode’s wide, patient shots make the loss land without spelling out every emotion.
They also praise the episode’s attention to the histories that disappear with people: family stories, memories, and the private meaning objects can hold. The relationship between Lee and Ginger brings another delicate shift, as the episode balances intimacy with uncertainty about what each character wants.
Other Conversation
In a brief personal tangent, Greenwald talks about juggling several books while traveling in London, including Razorblade Tears, Humboldt’s Gift, and Declare. The hosts also discuss the Eagles’ Jordan Davis trade, weighing the logic of a strong return against the emotional cost of losing a player they care about, and lament a lopsided basketball loss.